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A Conversation with
TS O'Rourke
author of
the best-seller
The Republican: An Irish Civil War Story
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He is an unusual writer in that he hates publicity.
He'd rather sit in a quiet room and belt out a few thousand words than give talks at writers'
groups or offer advice on what makes a writer 'tick'. In fact, it took some persuasions
(and a few pints) to get him loosened up and ready to talk openly about his new novel, The
Republican. His other novels are Ganglands (Breffni Books, 1996) and
Deathcall (Breffni Books, 1997). We caught up with TS O'Rourke
at The Palace Bar on Fleet Street, Dublin, Ireland, and tried to put him on the spot on history,
revisionism and popular belief. He insisted that we buy the beer. |
With Easter on the
horizon and all things Republican coming into focus, we thought we'd take a look at one
of the newest releases to grace the shelves of Irish bookstores and talk to its author.
The Republican - An Irish Civil War Story, is an
interesting read that attempts to fill in a few 'blanks' that were present in the standard
Irish history books that we were presented with in second level.
The novel, coming from the pen of TS O'Rourke (who achieved
some notoriety in the mid-90s as the author of one of Ireland's first true crime novels,
Ganglands) follows one man's civil war in Dublin City.
Not so unusual you might say? Well, actually it is. Roddy
Doyle has used The Rising and the Civil War in his last few books, but it has
always been as the backdrop--not the main story--with The Republican, however, it
is clear from the outset that this is a trip though one of the darkest days of Irish history,
a trip that is well researched and aptly described.
Reminding one of Liam O'Flaherty's writings from the 30s and 40s, The Republican
takes that few extra steps that O'Flaherty and his generation of writers were not
encouraged to make. That said one would be hard pressed to find better than O'Flaherty
in this time setting, and for obvious reasons. However, TS O'Rourke has managed to cut
through the clutter and tell one man's story of the Civil War in Dublin in an admirable
and convincing way.
O'Rourke had an unusual childhood, as his parents moved
around quite frequently. This, he says, is where his fervent imagination first showed
signs of its existence."We seemed to move every four or five years--it was
unsettling--but it was also an adventure: new towns, new schools, new problems to solve,
new accents to learn. It kept me on my toes. But always being the new kid in town meant
that I spent more time on my own than other kids did. I don't recall reading an awful lot,
nor of having any specific instant in time when I knew I had to write--it just kind of
happened."
| "History is
written in stone. I know that history is also written by the victor, but the truth, the
whole story of these terrible times, is now emerging and I have tried to present at least
a small picture of what the Civil War was like for a foot soldier, a volunteer, in Dublin
City."
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O'Rourke spent time in Tipperary, Cork, Dublin, Manchester,
London, Sydney and Canberra and more recently in Sweden. But where is home?
"Dublin is and always will be my home. It's the only place in
the world that I have that 'special' feeling--the desire to write. I've also felt it in Paris,
but it is much stronger in Dublin. In that respect, Dublin is with me wherever I am.
I need Dublin with me in order to be able to write."
So why write a book on the Civil War?
"I never set out to write this book. It came to me. I wasn't
looking. I know it sounds like your average publicity bull, but it's true. This story
took three generations to get to me."
We sat there expecting some Biblical revelation or divine
enlightenment.
"My grandfather gave a letter to my father when he reached
manhood. The letter was the last letter written by a close relation who had been executed
at the end of the Civil War. My father then gave me a copy of this letter. That's how it
all started. I had already written and published two novels when my father gave this
letter to me. Funnily enough, he didn't even think about the fact that it would spur me
on to write another book--he was just doing his thing as a father, showing his son what
had come before him, and hoping that I would show some interest in our nation's past."
Your relative--the one who was executed--he was on the
anti-Treaty side of the war?
"Yes. He was a member of the Dublin Brigade. He was caught
with a mining party on Dame Street attacking government offices that were then located in
Jury's Hotel. He was caught and sentenced under the Emergency Special Powers Act that was
passed by the acting Free State government in October 1922. A total of 77 volunteers were
secretly court-martialled and shot between October and the end to the Civil War. My relative
was one of those men. He's buried in the Republican Plot up in Glasnevin Cemetery."
So, how close to reality is the new novel--did you use your
relative's history in the book at all?
"It's fiction--historical fiction. Let's start there.
But as far as fiction goes, it is as close as anyone from my generation can come to the
real thing. History is
written in stone. I know that history is also written by the victor, but the truth, the
whole story of these terrible times, is now emerging and I have tried to present at least
a small picture of what the Civil War was like for a foot soldier, a volunteer, in Dublin
City. Of course I have taken liberties with historical characters and places--you have
to in such stories--and I hope that those liberties are not too far-fetched. I have
nothing but respect for those that fought on both sides of the Civil War. It is the terrible
beauty that Ireland gave birth to at the beginning of the last century, and we should
remember it and more importantly, understand it."
So was writing the book a way of learning more about what
actually happened?
"The letter I mentioned earlier was what drove my original
thirst for knowledge. I spent many hours in the National Library going over old Republican
despatches and pamphlets and in bookshops looking for publications that covered this period
in time. This was before I had even thought about writing a book. It was a simple need for
understanding. My Christian Brothers education didn't give me more than a blotchy and quite
partisan image of Ireland's history. I needed to know more and to understand what would make
a man fight against his former comrades."
So the book was the result of your research and not some
deeper need?
"I'd prefer to say that the book was a by-product of my
research. It sounds bad, I know. I'm not a self-publicist and I have no intention of
heading in that direction now.
| "We need to finally
close and heal the wounds of the Civil War--the wounds that our forefathers felt unable or unwilling to close--and
to move on. The nation can only become whole again once it faces its past, acknowledges
it and moves on. It's time for the older generations to get off the roundabout, time for
the younger ones to ask what the older generation were sore about in the first place."
|
I was shocked by what I learned the more I investigated our nation's past. I was also
saddened. Not just because of the fact that it happened as it did--but more so because
the younger generations don't know anything about it, and the fact that the older
generations still don't want to talk about it. I'm a member of the generation in-between.
I was lucky enough to understand the history and the importance of it without feeling
the needed to wear a badge, a lily, or whatever, indicating my political viewpoint."
So you sit on the fencepost when it comes to Irish politics?
"Never. But this is not a story about my political beliefs,
nor is it dredging up the past for the sake of cheap entertainment. It's a story of one man's
fight for what he believed in. We are still suffering from what people call 'Civil War
Politics' in Ireland. We have generation after generation voting in the same way as those
that came before them.
It's understandable, but the reasoning behind those beliefs has
been lost in the mists of time to the younger generations. It all seems so pointless
and circular. Ireland is a success. We have the respect of the leading nations in this
world and many nations aspire to follow in our footsteps. But yet we still have this
huge amount of baggage that we cannot and will not deal with. Those older generations
will be dead in the next twenty or thirty years, and we will have a generation behind
them that don't understand why they vote the way they do or what relevance the Civil
War has. Don't get me wrong. I'm not advocating one political viewpoint over
another--merely suggesting that history is where the future comes from. And no
future can be built on false hope or ignorance."
Is that why you wrote the book then--to open up a door
to the past for younger readers?
"That's a nice way of putting it, actually. I felt deprived
from a knowledge perspective, when it comes to Ireland's recent history. When I decided
to write the novel it was with the thought that people should know and understand what
makes men pick up a gun and fight--first the British and then their old comrades,
secure in the knowledge that they were doing the right thing. I wanted to explore one
man's thoughts, based on the political climate of those days and try to explain why
anyone would choose to fight on in the face of adversity."
Is this a side-swipe at the modern X-box generations
that count their blessings like they count their Euros?
"Yes and no. Materialism has never been my thing, but
whatever makes people happy is what they should go after. Having said that you do see
a lot of kids who have no idea what sacrifice and suffering is. That makes me feel
sick to my stomach. We are no longer a Third World nation, but that does not mean
that we should forget where we came from. We are three or four generations from the
potato fields, much as most people would like to forget that fact. We have emigrated
to the UK and the US for the past two hundred years in search of a better life. I did
it myself in the 80s, ending up in London for several years. But it wasn't adventure
it was necessity. I think that fact is lost on many of today's kids. They have it
too easy."
So what was your main reason for writing this novel?
"We need to finally close and heal the wounds of the
Civil War--the wounds that our forefathers felt unable or unwilling to close--and
to move on. The nation can only become whole again once it faces its past, acknowledges
it and moves on. It's time for the older generations to get off the roundabout, time for
the younger ones to ask what the older generation were sore about in the first place."
So this is a book about healing then?
"In a way, yes. But it is also story about adventure, fear,
trust, violence, betrayal and bravery. There's as much action and reaction in this novel
as there is in any modern crime novel--only you get to learn something about the birth of
the Irish Nation in this story too--at least I hope you do," O'Rourke laughed.
So what's next? Are you planning another novel?
"Let's just say I have an idea, and it's evolving quite
nicely."
* * *
*The Republican: An Irish Civil War Story is priced
€10.99 and is published by Killynon House Books. It is available in all good book shop in Ireland from Easter.
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2004-2006 the Dublin Quarterly--to see familiar things with unfamiliar eyes!
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